Note: My username slightly changed because my original email address was changed due to a requirement by the new owners, Yahoo.com.
Thank you all for the amazing responses, including the DNA reference which I have also read about.
1. My most amazing discovery (and I am only an amateur tourist OBSERVER and RESEARCHER, nothing more) is that the Greeks and the Irish disguised their land/sea maps within the statuary and mythology of their times.
The Greek statue Hades I strongly, strongly believe was North America, and the three headed dog Cerberus, is now the location of the Lake Superior area.
2. The Atlantic Ocean floor was dry, probably between 10 and 20 thousand years ago, steadily filling, requiring modifications in the mythologies, statuary, and artistic impressions. Example: The sitting Hades King was replaced with an escaping Hades on a chariot, abducting Persephone, most probably depicting the Bermuda to Mexico area of Central America.
Massive Roads, 3000 miles long from Gibraltar to Kitty Hawk North Carolina are visible on Google Earth satellite imagery, as well as National Oceanographic images of the Atlantic. Also, convergence points, 300 mile facial portraits of Kings are saturated across the floor of the Atlantic and all across the Americas too, if you can decipher the shadows in Photoshop.
I am now guessing, emphasis GUESSING, what we call Atlantis is probably a shortened version of the name... Ha-des, Land of the Gods, or Land of the Dead.... as in "Haa-tee-tee-lan-tos", and extends from the original near southwest Greenland, and with the floods, progressed down towards Bermuda, then west to the Yucatan and Mexico.
I say the Athenians were so knowledgeable of the Atlantic Ocean floor, they were "closet Atlanteans". Of the 75 tribes that made up the "Greater Greek area confederation of cultures", united by Alexander the Great (Arksantris, Arkansas), they all seem to appear in the Americas. This includes the Lakota (Laconia), and the Sioux (Zeus), and the Dakotas (Dactyls Zeus).
Note: I am of a major belief that the Egyptians (Shu progressing to Zeus), preceeded the Athenians, and they themselves were preceeded by unknown astronomical cultures, probably related to the ancestors of Osiris, and the knowledge cultures... i.e., Te-ho-tee, God of Gods, which was "Divine Wisdom". Massive Venus star and Plaiedes alignments are visible on many Atlantic and Pacific floor locations.
While I understand that we may be passionate about certain things, especially if they are new or if they overturn our previous concepts, as with the fascinating problem of whether the ancients set foot in the New World, we must also most of all be cautious about what we say and how we go about affirming our arguments.
In the particular issue of interest here, we have so far no tangible evidence that people from the ancient world ever reached the Americas, at least not preceding the Norse in the 10th century A.D. The few pieces of evidence found in the 19th century proved to be hoaxes.
Suppose even for a while that the Greeks had once reached the North American continent; then wht do we not have any record of this, not even th slightest mention of it? We know that a Greek once traveled as far as Iceland, because we have traces of his lost account in other authors. Why then wouldn't it be the case if a Greek traveler had once decided to explore the Atlantic? Of course, there is the possibility of an accidental discovery (due to a storm, etc) by a small crew, something which wouldn't leave any archaeological trace, but even if we take this into account, there is a very large gap to bridge before making the Greeks the originators of any North American culture, just like the Greek traveler Pytheas did not bring his Greek culture with him to Iceland.
Besides, the most likely people of the Mediterranean basin to have had the chance--and capacity--to land in the New World would have been the Phoenicians/Carthaginians, not the Greeks. Even there, what we can say for the Greeks holds true for them as well. We know that they have circumnavigated Africa on their own. Yet this feat never resulted in any Punic cultural development in Africa. Even if the Phoenicians did land in America, this could not have triggered any cultural development there.
We simply cannot base an entire theory just on typonymy or a few, scant information. It is important to remain open-minded, and ready to advance new theories, but these must be based on solid proof, not a few improbable evidence. Even if the Ancients reached North America--if they did--this discovery could not and did not result in an entire cultural exchange. For this to happen, there needs to be strong, permanent contact between two cultures over a long period of time. The Roman empire and the Persian lands up to India were Hellenized precisely because there was a strong and permanent contact between Greek culture and the others, but no such thing could have happened even if they reached America.
Laellius... Excellent response, and I thank you for it.
First of all, what is proof of cultural exchange?
Is DNA evidence one piece of proof? Are naming conventions another? What you call "hoaxes", couldn't they have been wrong on third elements of proof?
I am not here to prove, just to put on the table all the elements I have read, all the pieces I have observed with my own eyes, for all to see, for the next generation to find out more.
The primary embarrassing question I have for valid questions like yourselves is... don't take me wrong...
"What is Greek to you?" "Who are Greeks to you?"
I am sure that it would be just as puzzling, 1000 years from now, when digging up an American neighborhood in Costa Rica, to prove American presence. People will ask... "What do you call American?".
There were probably 75 colonies of Greeks all over the Med and North America and Africa, spreading their DNA, their pottery, etc.
A purist would note... no, those are Phoenician pottery samples, or Carthaginian, or Morroccan, or Celtic.
And I would say... as in... didn't the Danaans become the Danes of Denmark, who were Phoenicians, who became the Vikings, who became the Normans, who mixed with the Anglo, weren't they also Greek-ish?
You know at least one author has said, the Mayan language is 60% Greek, but I even question him, and he still may have been right, because there may have been 75 languages which evolved into the more modern Greek language.
I think in the near future, you will be pleasantly surprised by the new evidence that is showing up, that ancient Greek tribes may have "walked across the Atlantic", and become one of more than 500 Amerindian cultures, with distinct skin colors, with distinct theologies, with distinct pottery markings, and dialects.
And several if not many, were what we would NOW call Greek tribes.
The last genetic studies I read (and it has been a while since I've done so and I've since lost/forgotten where the study was published - surely pre-Internet), the North American Amerinds have been linked to a now obscure (but still existing in east Asia, the Korean peninsula, I think ) Mongolian tribe. The study even had photos which is what helped mark it in my memory. They certainly did not look like any Hellene of any age as I would imagine, but definitely favored American "Indians".
You are so close to an important point, but I don't think you realize how true you are, for the wrong and right reasons.
On looks alone, would you believe there are tribes in China who look Irish and Greek?
Or tribes in Mongolia who were blonde haired, blue eyes, with Greek Amazonian DNA, according to Spencer Well's research..."Genome Project". Grand Central DNA-station was Africa, but #2 was the central Asian area, Kazackastan, Tajikistan, wherein all Greeks, Amerindians, Japanese, Europeans came from.
And do you know how close Mongolia is to Canada, when the Arctic Ocean was navigable and partially dry? I am preparing an article on my favorite oceanfloor statue, about 90 miles long, on the Arctic floor, just North of the coast of Siberia! It appears to be "Tehotee", the Egyptian bird image of Osiris, the "wandering sage". From the Egyptian Tehoti came the Teutonic Knights, the Totonakas of the Valley of Mexico, and the Greek Titans... I firmly believe this but cannot prove.
There even appears to be ancient roads from Siberia across to Canada and Ireland.
In the same area, the Arctic North was known as Hyper Borea... Upper North in Greek, I believe.
And close by was "Tartarus", a second Atlantean reference name, I believe.
A third name I am tracking down, and that is the name Boetia, North of Canada, not to be confused with the Boetia of the Aegean Islands.
So for Irish and Greek looking tribes of Western China and Mongolia... I give you Simon Narramore, aka 62Lofu on Flickr...
Koreans are very western looking to me, sort of culturally split between Asian and caucasian.
I am not asking for ANYONE to believe me, even though my material comes virtually 100% from library published sources, of theories from other authors over the last 500 years. We could be all wrong, or all right, or somewhere in between.
Ancient Greeks in America
Posted - 01 Jan 2009 : 13:19:59
